Neji

[Seigen]

After the time skip, just what quality did neji show to become Jounnin and Lee stayed chuunin. Combat wise, lee is faster than neji if he takes off the weights, and if he even uses 2 of the gates he would crush him.

[Guest SpionKop]

That is, if Lee could even touch Neji. Considering that he could defend himself with Hakkeshou Kaiten and attack from afar with Hakke Kuushou, Neji would have a fair chance at beating Lee.

And the whole "genius" thing.

[Seigen]

But how many times do you think he could get it off before lee catchins him when he stops spinning.

[Guest SpionKop]

That's the point. He doesn't stop. D:.

And even though Dai Hakkeshou Kaiten is only in some Naruto game, it's reasonable to assume that Neji would have somehow improved his Hakkeshou Kaiten, possibly to achieve a higher range, which would force Lee to get far away from Neji. Once Lee is far away, Neji has the advantage.

[Seigen]

Neji will have the same advantage away as lee. None! there both taijutsu users . And trust me, its either he keep going and waste all his charka, or stop and get wooped

[Guest SpionKop]

there both taijutsu users .

That's a big generalisation. That's like saying that Shikamaru should be able to defeat his father easily since both use shadows. You have to account for a difference in skill level and such.

And trust me, its either he keep going and waste all his charka, or stop and get wooped

Or he push Lee away from him with Hakkeshou Kaiten and then kick his fuzzy-eyebrow-arse.

[Azure]

And we're forgetting the Hyuuga Taijutsu no less? If Lee's insides start bleeding, he won't be doing much.

[Guest Rei-Chun]

And this is why I have a strong dislike for Rock lee faboys, rather than look logically at a situation, you say "lee's faster than X so he's stronger and better and . . . cooler.”

Combat wise Rock Lee is one of the more limited characters in the Naruto series second to the sound shinobi Zaku. Lee is limited to Taijutsu and close range attacks that is a proven fact. Even if Neji is a master of Hyuuga Taijutsu (among other arts) he's still able to use chakra-based attacks, which Mister Rock cannot. The basics of Ninjutsu sand Genjutsu are required for shinobi combat and difcult missions. Although Lee is more skilled with his hands and faster than the average shinobi against a long-ranged opponent, a Genjutsu specialist or someone with-rapid-cellular regeneration, it will do little good. Furthermore, lee lacks stealth, which happens to be one of the more important shinobi traits.

Hitsugaya Toushiro, you overlook one important fact of the Naruto world: Combat skills play a small part in promotions. According to your logic Naruto should be Chuunin because he crushed Neji in the exam, sadly (for you), the world doesn't work like that. Overall Neji has better shinobi traits, he's more calm, hails from a noble clan (huge advantage) and has leadership qualities (Lee is a follower not a leader).

Hitsugaya, do you know exactly what happened during the skip? For all we know Konoha was short on elite and promoted their best Chuunin, which Lee is not.

[Guest Ichi-kun]

With what Rei said, look at Shikamaru, the only chuunin from the CE to gain that rank. Why? He never even won? Ill tell you why because there is more to higher ranks than being able to beat up someone, you must take that into consideration before runnin your mouth that Lee could own Neji.

With that being said, we can put this theory to the test in the prac arena. Me being a strictly long distance Shinobi, and you being a Tai user. We can set up a fight and see if your right?

Edited June 7, 2006 by Ichigo

[Guest Rei-Chun]

With what Rei said, look at Shikamaru, the only chuunin from the CE to gain that rank. Why? He never even won? Ill tell you why because there is more to higher ranks than being able to beat up someone, you must take that into consideration before runnin your mouth that Lee could own Neji.

With that being said, we can put this theory to the test in the prac arena. Me being a strictly long distance Shinobi, and you being a Tai user. We can set up a fight and see if your right?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Our role-play world is based more on the characters statistics in battle while the Naruto world is more strategy based. With that in mind any study we conduct would have different results. By long range I meant Ninjutsu not weaponry.

[Seigen]

Hitsugaya Toushiro, you overlook one important fact of the Naruto world: Combat skills play a small part in promotions. According to your logic Naruto should be Chuunin because he crushed Neji in the exam, sadly (for you), the world doesn't work like that. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I never once put naruto into this. and Kop and everyone eles, how does neji plan on hitting him with hyuuga taijutsu. If he cant catch is oppenent, (And hes only considered a geneis from his clan orgin, not like hes super smart.)Im sure lee is just as smart as Neji

[Guest Rei-Chun]

I never once put naruto into this.

It seems you've overlooked by point entirely. According to you Lee should be a Jounnin because he's ‘a better fighter than Neji,' if that's the case than Naruto should be Chuunin and Shikamaru a Gennin. Once again: Promotions aren't based on combat skills alone, you're clearly missing that point.

Im sure lee is just as smart as Neji

HA! Neji has 2.5/5.0 intelligence (Data book score) only a handful of character has beyond that, it's said to say Lee is not on that list. In fact, Sasuke doesn't score this on high on his intelligence.

Edit: Lee's lowest stat, excluding Nin/Gen, is his intelligence, thus you're wrong.

Edited June 8, 2006 by Rei-Chun

[Seigen]

But, is that higher than people Like Shikimaru's, if you want to talk leadership qualities, then Shkimaru has a better chance than Neji as well to be jounnin

[Nappers]

@ Hitsu: Stop confusing your argument. You stated that Lee is as smart as Neji; you are wrong. Now you're trying to alter your statement to Neji being as smart as Shikimaru. If proven that Neji isnt as smart as Shikimaru that won't prove that Lee is as intelligent as Neji, and still will -not- prove that Lee should be Jounin.

[Seigen]

God this topic is making me brain dead. screw the whole thing.

[Guest Rei-Chun]

You're still are missing the point: To advance to Jounnin you need leadership qualities, Shinobi skills and tactical knowledge among other skills. Rock lee lacks leadership and tactical knowledge of a Jounnin. Moreover, he's limited to Taijutsu which is a disability on the battlefield. Unless you can come up with reasonable defense that isn't "Lee's a better fighter, he's faster and has Gates,” I don't see why he should be a Jounnin.

[Seigen]

I said screw the topic for a reason mom . And even if I was able to prove it you wouldnt buy it anyways because you cant stand lee.

[Nappers]

Its not a matter of 'standing' Lee. Its about weighing up the differences in the characters, and assesing the qualities which are essential to achieve the ranks of Jounin. Leadership, tactical knowledge, diversity, natural ability, talent and skill are all things that Neji has over Lee.

All you would need to do is highlight an 'actual' reason, logically, as to why Rock Lee should be Jounin (at his current level) and there can be no arguments. However you are unable to provide one. Your entire argument is "Lee would beat Neji in a fight" which in itself is questionable.

[Seigen]

Why are we still talking about this. I gave up ok.Now plz just shut the damn topic up

[Guest SpionKop]

how does neji plan on hitting him with hyuuga taijutsu.

I've said it several times: Hakke Kuushou.

[Mokujin]

I actually believe that Lee could hold his own against Neji without opening the gates... True, Neji has the edge of range with that Hakke Kuushou technique of his, and his defense is pretty heavy with his Hakkeshou Kaiten technique, but how long do you think Neji would need to keep up with this barrage of techniques...? Lee was moving fast enough to shock Kakashi at Gennin level, meaning he's more than likely to be much faster after 2 and 1/2 years of training... That gives him a big advantage in the field of evasion... After all, it doesn't matter how much range Neji has if he can't hit the opponent at all, right...?

Now, as for close range-combat, Neji would probably have a difficult time Keeping up, and would likely have to rely on Hakkeshou Kaiten a lot if he were to defend against Lee's attacks... Being flung away by that technique would likely do very little collateral damage, though... Also, Neji's chakra obviously isn't infinite, and repeated use of Hakkeshou Kaiten and Hakke Kuushou would likely cause him to run out of Chakra before Lee would wear down... Once Neji is unable to use his chakra, his offense will be effectively crushed, giving Lee quite an advantage...

This is, of course, assuming Lee has the weights off, which he should... Lee could probably bear opening the Initial gate without much of a negative effect, further enhancing his speed by a great margin...

So yeah, it's definitely possible for Lee to take on Neji, I say...

[Nappers]

The actual point raised was that Rock Lee should be of Jounin Rank along with Neji, not 'who would win'.

The only argument raised was Rock Lee's combat ability and nothing else. Completely looking over the qualities it takes to be a Jounin, its not solely about who can beat who.

[Guest SpionKop]

After all, it doesn't matter how much range Neji has if he can't hit the opponent at all, right...?

You forget that Sasuke was able to match Lee's weightless speed after only a month of training. If Sasuke, who is less of a genius than Neji, could match Lee's speed after one month, who's to say that Neji could not only match but exceed that speed?

[Guest Saphyrim]

That is, if Neji really wished to have trained himself in nothing but Taijutsu. I believe it was stated that Kakashi was training Sasuke in mostly Taijutsu, so his speed was capable of reaching to the point where he was capable of utilizing the Chidori effectively. Don't know for sure, but Neji seems like he'd train in both Taijutsu and Ninjutsu, but in Taijutsu more so, whilst Lee trains completely in Taijutsu. His speed may be capable of reaching to an extraordinary point after the 2 and ½ years of training, but Lee's would still most likely top Neji's.

Also, I think Mokujin meant that even if Neji is capable of attacking from afar with long-ranged attacks, that doesn't mean they'd actually hit Lee, seeing as with his excessive speed, he could easily dodge them before they'd get in close enough, so if Neji doesn't want to waste chakra on techniques that have a very low chance of hitting, he'd most likely have to go over towards close-range attacks, which is what Lee is best at.

[Guest SpionKop]

That is, if Neji really wished to have trained himself in nothing but Taijutsu. I believe it was stated that Kakashi was training Sasuke in mostly Taijutsu, so his speed was capable of reaching to the point where he was capable of utilizing the Chidori effectively. Don't know for sure, but Neji seems like he'd train in both Taijutsu and Ninjutsu, but in Taijutsu more so, whilst Lee trains completely in Taijutsu. His speed may be capable of reaching to an extraordinary point after the 2 and ½ years of training, but Lee's would still most likely top Neji's.

First of all, we've never seen Neji use ninjutsu ever. It can be assumed that he doesn't really know nothing past the basics (Henge, Bunshin, Kawarimi). Also, Sasuke wasn't training in only Taijutsu--remember, he learned Chidori during that month. And Lee even said when watching Sasuke, "You achieved in one month the speed it took me years to get." Even if Neji only trained partially in Taijutsu, he could meet or exceed Lee's speed.

Also, I think Mokujin meant that even if Neji is capable of attacking from afar with long-ranged attacks, that doesn't mean they'd actually hit Lee, seeing as with his excessive speed, he could easily dodge them before they'd get in close enough, so if Neji doesn't want to waste chakra on techniques that have a very low chance of hitting, he'd most likely have to go over towards close-range attacks, which is what Lee is best at.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But if Neji can match Lee's movements tit for tat, his attacks will hit. Especially since, given the Byakugan, he'll never lose sight of Lee, whereas Neji could dash right behind Lee and it'd take him a moment to figure out where Neji was.